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98: Convenience & Efficiency vs. Quality – Can We Have It All?

Benedikt made some experiments at the end of 2021, mostly comparing analog gear to plugins (among other tests he did), trying to figure out where he can make things more efficient without sacrificing quality. Ideally even improving the quality of his work while also moving faster and more intuitive.

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We wanted to talk about it and share his findings, as we think it will be encouraging and empowering to you.

And there's more to this: 

If you've been listening for a while, you know how much we love efficiency. But we thought about it again and decided that we really wanted to talk about the importance of setting a high quality standard for yourself, going the extra mile and not sacrificing anything for convenience.

Art is not convenient. But creating art can be more efficient and frictionless than a lot of people believe. 

So the questions are:

  • Where's the line? 
  • When are you starting to compromise the quality of your work?
  • And when is a supposed "quality upgrade" not really worth it or actually a downgrade?

Let's discuss!

Book A Free Coaching Call With Benedikt:


This episode was edited by Thomas Krottenthaler.

Benedikt's voice on this episode has been recorded with the Antelope Axino Synergy Core.


Automatic Episode Transcript — Please excuse any errors, not reviewed for accuracy (click for full transcript)

TSRB Podcast Episode 98 - Convenience & Efficiency vs. Quality - Can We Have It All?

[00:00:00] Benedikt: only if you really compare only if you don't sacrifice the end result, like all that matters is what comes out of the speakers.

[00:00:10] And that's really how I want to think about this whole conversation. So. Yeah. 

[00:00:14] Malcom: Yeah. 

[00:00:28] Benedikt: Hello and welcome to the self recording band podcast. I am your host then at the time. And I am here with my friend and cohost Malcolm Owen flood. Hello, Malcolm. Hello. Hello. 

[00:00:37] Malcom: Hello. I'm great, man. How are you? How are 

[00:00:40] Benedikt: you? great. We have our new kitten Elmo. Elmo has moved in with us. 

[00:00:46] Malcom: awesome. I was hoping to see Elmo wandering around in the background, but not yet.

[00:00:49] Benedikt: Not yet. No, I, I was, I was helping to bring them as well, but he's asleep now and I'm actually glad he's asleep because he's a tyrant. So he's a small, annoying tire. And so [00:01:00] far, like he, he's just small cats. Like, I'm so glad for every, it's almost like I'm talking about a kid, but like he he's, uh, we're glad for every hour he's, he's asleep as cute as he is.

[00:01:13] Malcom: Yeah, just unlimited energy. I'm sure. 

[00:01:15] Benedikt: energy I'm sure. Yeah. That's great

[00:01:17] Malcom: I have a, uh, an exciting gear purchase

[00:01:19] Benedikt: Oh, I am excited. What's what's up. roll, please.

[00:01:23] Malcom: Drum roll, please. I have ordered a new MacBook pro

[00:01:29] Benedikt: Oh, wow. You 

[00:01:30] Malcom: for I went for 

[00:01:32] Benedikt: went for it went 

[00:01:33] Malcom: Promax 32 gigs. One terabyte hard drive terabyte hard 

[00:01:37] Benedikt: So you max it out, you max it out like the CPU 

[00:01:40] Malcom: much. can go higher in storage and you can have more Ram if you want, but it's like, that's a crazy amount of power for audio production. audio production

[00:01:48] Benedikt: but you haven't got it yet right 

[00:01:51] Malcom: Nope sometime between the 15th of December and the new year, it's meant to show up, I'll probably be in Mexico when it shows up. So I'm going to have to get [00:02:00] on that once I get back. But I'm very excited because my current computer is kind of crapping out on me, so couldn't come soon enough, couldn't 

[00:02:07] Benedikt: come soon totally.

[00:02:08] Malcom: I was gonna be excited and very excited to report on how it handles, uh, heavy mixing sessions and stuff.

[00:02:14] Benedikt: Did you, did you check like competent compatibility charts and stuff like with your plugins and what you're using? I did a bit. 

[00:02:20] Malcom: I did a bit. I'm also kind of winging it. I've got so many goddamn plugins, you know? So it's like, if my favorite one isn't there, I'm going to find another tool that does the job, but I'm just gonna make it work. gonna make it 

[00:02:30] Benedikt: Yeah, for sure. For sure. For sure. I can't wait. I can't wait to, to hear what you say about this. Yeah, this is going to be a big, big step forward compared to your machine now. And this is, it's a crazy, crazy thing to say, because you were on a, I don't know, 2016 MacBook pros, or you'd assume it's a powerful machine, but compared to these new ones, did. Oh, it's just come so 

[00:02:51] Malcom: Oh it's just come so far. It's yeah, it's totally mind blowing that. It's just like such a big jump in computer processing power crazy. But, uh, yeah, I'm also [00:03:00] very stoked for its video capabilities because you and I definitely want to do some more video stuff moving forward. I think so there's a little teaser for you. Audience, more video stuff coming. video 

[00:03:10] Benedikt: absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah, I can't wait. And what you said is actually a pretty great segue into today's episode because you said I have so many plugins and whenever something's not working, I can just use something else, which is pretty much what I wanted to talk about today. Um, so today is not like a. It's not a certain topic. We would have like bullet points in the, in an outline and stuff. It's like, it's more or less a story I wanted to share because last week, and like for actually for the last two weeks, I did some experimenting and I wanted to figure out how I can make things more efficient and fast because I have so much on my plate without sacrificing quality. That was the number one concern that I, whenever I want to get faster or more efficient, or when I want to make things more convenient. I always want to make sure that the end result like the product that I'm making[00:04:00] does not suffer from that, that I'm not sacrificing anything important. And the, the, the situation that I was in or that I'm still in is that I have some pretty decent analog ear, not only decent, like pretty great high end and luckier and a bunch of. plugins of course, that I, that I love to use. And some, some techniques that I, that I always use or oftentimes use, and I started questioning. I just wanted to question all of that. Once at least I just wanted to go through everything. I'm doing everything I'm using and question everything I have and find out whether or not I really need that sort of stuff. And so I have these analog pieces mostly because. I did some tests over the years. And every time I did shootouts between those pieces that I have with plugins, the analytics stuff always won. And the reason for that was because I compared the stuff I had to the clones, like the plugin clones, or because I have things that are so unique or special sounding that there is no like actual [00:05:00] clone in software in the software world. So I thought what I can do with these boxes can, I can only do with the actual box. So there was no. Like equivalent, like no thing, no such thing in the door that I could use. So I just kept using the hardware for in specific cases for specific things. Now, this. I did the test again, but I did it a little differently. I thought, okay. I have my, for example, I have my destressor and I have a distress, a plugin or several, several, just the stress of plugins actually. Now, when I compare them directly with the same settings, or even if I try different settings and just try to match the sound, I can get close, but it's not quite the same. Mostly the saturation was the thing that in this particular example was the thing that was different. I just liked the way the destressor saturates. The stories is just such a cool, good sound that none of the plugins do when you push them really hard, that's their weak point. I think that's like even the rouser by the same company. It's amazing. Plugin sounds super awesome. But when you push it really hard compared to the hardware destressor, [00:06:00] it, like, it sounds like farting a little bit, you know, like it's not this the super smooth. Distortion that you get from the Harvard box. So, but this time I thought. This is not exactly the same, but what if I combine the distress, a plugin with an amazing situation, plug in, it just built myself a chain that does the same thing or a similar thing. That's just as cool. Um, and I would find, I would try to find work arounds in the software world that would just make me faster. That would make things more efficient without sacrificing what I loved about the stressor. And so that got me started and I went down this path and compared all the things and the takeaways from that is what I wanted to share with you today because I wanted to make a really. Empowering encouraging episode, I know that a lot of our listeners don't have wrecks of expensive analog gear. And I just I'm. I wanted to do this episode to let you know that you can do it. Like you can do it with whatever you have or at least with some cheap options. And I want, I also want to say that are some things you need to take care of all, like, you need to be careful about like that [00:07:00] it's that there are some traps that you can fall into, but basically I. Bottom line is I'm going to get rid of a bunch of stuff because I know I can do it faster, easier, and actually that might lead to a better end result, I think. And we'll get into

[00:07:14] Malcom: It probably will. Yeah. I was going to say it'll probably end up lead like that, that added efficiency is going to just lead to better results and more to be capability, you know, like you're going to find something that gives you that saturation you looking for. But it's going to have a bunch of controls on it. Now 

[00:07:28] Benedikt: Yeah 

[00:07:29] Malcom: you're going to have the ability to tweak it even further. Yeah, that, that's very cool. I was going to say the destressor is the one thing that I've, I also have had a hard time finding in the box. It's just, I, I don't have a destresser plugin because I've never, I've never found one that I like w compared to the real thing. Um, but I totally agree. If I wanted to get that effect and just recreate it, using more plugins, that's totally an option. And you know, nowadays this has kind of an old school habit. I need to break. Actually, I like to use [00:08:00] one, like if I want a sound, I want to find it in one plugin, you know? So I wanted to distress or sound, I want one distressor plugin. That's going to give me that rather than a chain. But now you have, you can have like plugging presets where you just. Type in your preset name and it just drops in the whole chain for you. So I just need to create my destressor plugin and get used to that workflow. to that

[00:08:21] Benedikt: Yeah. for sure. And you can, it's the added tweak ability. It's the efficiency, but it's also the fact that you have now. 10 stressors if you want to. And like that's, that's such a cool thing and yeah, I mean, I think, and I would love to hear your opinion on that Malcolm when it comes to what, um, when we talk about like analog versus digital and there's more to it that I want to cover in this episode, but that start with this. When, when we talk about analog versus digital, I never thought that that, that one is better than the other. It's just different. They all are tools and like, whatever works. But I think the one thing when you compare like one [00:09:00] plug into one piece of hardware, the one thing that the hardware always like nails to me is like, is the saturation is the color it adds. And it is, I don't know, it's something. It's not the way it compresses. It's not the way the attack and release works. And with accuse, it's also not really like the, the shape of the curves or anything like that. Like you cannot recreate all of that in the box. Pretty perfectly. It's, it's just the box tone itself and how it behaves when you push it really hard. That's the main. For me. And since I like to push things really hard and I like the distortion, that's always the thing that kept me, at least in certain instances that they've kept me using the analog stuff. So I guess if we can find a way to work around that that would be no need for the analog stuff, other than it and is

[00:09:47] Malcom: Yeah. So I don't have any hardware. Really. I do have a 10 73 style preamp in front of me that honestly hardly ever gets used because there's a plug-in version. Just the door and that, that I can track through with the [00:10:00] universal audio consulting. So like I got to sell this. That's what it comes down to. I really got to get rid of this thing. I just like how it looks in front of me. How stupid is that? How stupid is That 

[00:10:09] Benedikt: I don't 

[00:10:09] Malcom: like I don't like empty Rackspace's, but, uh, luckily I only have a couple of spots. 

[00:10:14] Benedikt: Yeah 

[00:10:15] Malcom: But yeah, it's got to go. The only thing I like hardware for is just tracking on the way in, and it's not because it sounds better. It's just because it's in that case with my work. Am I like experienced in these studios. It's, it's easier. It's a convenience thing to just like, oh, I just need to compress this on the way in. And then I know I don't have to worry about that plugin existing anymore. Like it's it. I don't have to open something to my computer. It just happens before it even hits the computer. So it's really just a mindset, workflow thing. Um, it is not a necessity at all. at 

[00:10:45] Benedikt: I a hundred percent agree when it comes to tracking. I love hardware and that's why that's also the, the main reason why I got it, like all this stuff. But since I'm not tracking anymore, like very rarely there's nothing like I can't justify having that stuff. So, but that was the reason because I just liked [00:11:00] to, as you said, like, make it sound as good as possible before it even reaches the company. That being said, that brings me to the next thing that I wanted to talk about on this episode. And that is convenience versus sound quality because we always need to be careful to not sacrifice something important just because of convenience. And I've. So, first of all, I think art is not meant to be convenient, like in order to create really great art. That is exciting. We have, sometimes we have to go the extra mile. Like it's the same when it comes to, as we often talked about when it comes to editing, spending hours on like tiny tweaks, that barely make a difference. But in like the sum of all of it just makes a difference and like it's worth putting in the time and effort. So it's not about making everything as convenient as possible. It's just about eliminating the stuff that just doesn't make a difference, or that actually might. Might make us slower and therefore less objective over time and all of that. So there's this balance here. And I think when it comes to the tracking, [00:12:00] if you have really great gear that you know how to operate, then that is awesome. And I think it's worth having that when you record it's better than, than just recording boring tracks and then doing everything in the box. That being said, I don't think there's a lot of. To having a whole bunch of like cheap clones or cheap analog gear that That they might be convenient and it might be cool to be able to reach to your desk and grab the queue and maybe we'd have to compare, or like, I dunno, maybe, maybe it is better to do that for some people. But I think for, in most cases, if you don't have like really good gear or if you don't really know what you're doing, it might be a better idea to track through good plugins for. If you want to, to on the way in then like buying a bunch of like cheap stuff that you can't afford. That's but that's not really great sounding. You might lose quality while thinking you gain something because it looks like an 1176 and it [00:13:00] feels great to touch and like it's fast and convenient. So there's that there might be this trade off. It might sound better and bigger if you don't use that stuff and do it with a good plugging. So that's just what I want to say, because I know that a lot of people love these, these clowns and they are super available now. And there are also like cheap analytic mixing desks that are meant for jam spaces or whatever. And people use them to track through them. I don't know, but there might be a benefit of T to not use these Yeah Totally.

[00:13:29] Malcom: Yeah, totally. Yeah. Not all hardware is created equal. That's definitely a thing. So you might think, Hey, this 11 to 76 is only 350 bucks. That's going to be awesome. But your noise floor, like they're, they're noisy. So you now have a buzz through your whole vocal track that doesn't need to be there. It's just a compressor. Like it's not adding enough to be worth any noticeable buzz period. Right? So, and another thing that you might not be considering. Like when I use hardware, I'm at a studio with top the line, like literally world-class converters. So [00:14:00] whenever we send something out to hardware for potentially converting from digital to analog, I mean, it depends if you're going on the way in or whatnot, but there's like every stage there's something happening. And if you're using a cheap interface, that's not really good. You're probably degrading your quality at every time you sent in and out of your computer. Um, something to think about there. to think about there

[00:14:23] Benedikt: Yes. A hundred percent agree. So the way I look at it is I think when any. When we purely talk about sound. I think that really great analog gear is better than plugins in many cases, but not, not much better, not, not like, not like very much better. And then but good plugins are better than cheap and luckier usually. And I think so I think that's the hierarchy and there's only, it's only worth using the very high end analog gear. If. Y a, you know what you're doing with it, you have good enough converters to make use [00:15:00] of it, or like on the way. And if it makes you, yeah. If you know what you're doing, and if it really makes you more efficient or faster or more creative, if it inspires you, that can also be something that we could talk about. Like when, when you just like creating more, when you use these things, maybe that's worth it. So, but, but only then. And in all other cases, I think you're better off using a very, a very good plugin instead of the hardware. And yeah, I think, I think that's basically how I, how I look at it, how I view it and I've, and the same thing is true for workflow, things that we do, or for a certain things we. We just do without ever questioning. Like I did not only compare hardware to plugins. I compare certain ways of doing things in general. Like for example, I compared parallel. But like parallel drum compression on an actual send and return, versus just putting a compressor on the drum bus and using the wet, dry knob, you know, which is essentially the same thing, but maybe one is [00:16:00] faster than the other or, or more convenient. And maybe, and if it's more convenient, do I get the same sound or do I treat it differently? Do I sacrifice something? So I just questioned all these things and try different workflow. And some things, um, I'll keep doing not because they are technically better, but just because I get better results doing them because of the way I think about these things and the way my brain works and I view routing and all of that, but some things can actually be done simpler and therefore quicker. And it will, I will be more objective. Um, throughout the session, if I, if I just save some time there and like, there's this trade-off so, but I always, and that's the thing I want to, I really want to point out is I always think about and compare the actual result and I never want to do something just because it's convenient. So this is, this is the main thing here, because I see this discussion. Uh, sometimes lead to the conclusion that efficiency and workflow is everything, and you gotta be fast and you can just use plugins and hardware is not worth [00:17:00] using and all these things. And that, that is not entirely correct. Like some of it is correct, but it's only if you really compare only if you don't sacrifice the end result, like all that matters is what comes out of the speakers. And that's really how I want to think about this whole conversation. So. Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:17:16] Malcom: Yeah. Yeah. It, it just kinda made me think that I did attract an album last April or may or something. And we did it in the jam space with the band. I think I probably talked about it at the time, the bands Vogue villains, and we decided we weren't going to a studio to do it and we cut it in their jam space. So we didn't have hardware at all just in the box stuff. Yeah. I'm kind of now realizing I'm about to be mixing it very soon. And, uh, finally, and, uh, it, it made me kind of think it's like, we got really, really good results. Like some of the best results that I've ever had. Um, like I'm thrilled with it and I can't wait to mix it because it's already sounds insane. And it's like, okay. So we didn't have hardware to think of. To focus on. So what did we focus on? Like, [00:18:00] well, because we were saving money on studio, I insisted on a drum tech and new drum skins for both sessions, but it was two different sessions for drums, separate from each other. And the drum tech was there both times that paid off huge. We had now turned to guitar, strings

[00:18:15] Benedikt: Yeah.

[00:18:16] Malcom: and guitars, you know, just like, Hey, we, we had every guitar bass covered. You can think of and different amps and stuff like, like. Really big on the things that I knew that counted like, like 80 20 that, you know, and I was like, this is going to give us the biggest bang for buck. Let's go double down on that and not worry about all this other stuff. And it paid off so huge. So that's just like a perfect example of like, you know, Benny sell all that gear and this is going to make room for stuff that actually matters that 

[00:18:41] Benedikt: actually And like talking about convenience, it's not really convenient to use a different guitar on everything, the part or song, or to change strings all the time and take care of the tuning. Like all of that is it's the opposite of convenience, but you still do it because like it matters, but other things don't matter as much. So you don't really, you should, you should allocate your time and your money [00:19:00] and all of your resources to things that actually move the needle. So.

[00:19:03] Malcom: Yep. Yep 

[00:19:05] Benedikt: but it would be a very wrong decision to say, let's get, just do everything with this one guitar. And let's just not change strings because that's convenient and fast. That that would be like a, not a good thing to do. So. the 

[00:19:16] Malcom: It happens all the time to think about People are like, okay, well, we're just going to book like this really expensive room, giant studio for our small sounding acoustic album or something. And I've got my one, $300 acoustic. It's like, well, okay, that's going to sound bad that's going 

[00:19:31] Benedikt: to Sorry 

[00:19:33] Malcom: Sorry. made the wrong decision the 

[00:19:35] Benedikt: totally. Totally. Yeah. It just goes to show how, yeah. How much the details matter. And. Not everything is just has the same impact. So when people see like big mixers or engineers move into the box, there's always these people who like, okay, from now on everything that they're about to do will sound worse and like, why don't they just use their analog gear? It's all about convenience these [00:20:00] days. And it just, it's such a shame. And I just think. A, I think these people, especially the people who came from analog, they spend, they spend a lot of time trying to not make any, like, not cut any corners. And like the time that take to transition from analog to end the box is like, it's insane. Like when you read these interviews with these people or watch their interviews on YouTube, they spend years sometimes trying to recreate what they had and the analog, the main, and only when they get to the point where it really sounds to. They finally make the move. I mean, there's always the exception, but they, they, they can't afford to any, to sacrifice any of that. And they really like people like Andrew chefs or Michael Brower or people like that who went finally went into, into the box. They spent years refining that, that process and like figuring out what tools to use. And like, because it's like not, it's not just swapping out a piece of hardware versus the, the plug-in version is there's a lot more that goes into this. And, um, so they really don't cut corners. I was, I, I just wanted to give one [00:21:00] more example of, of that I have still, uh, a Pultec IQ, a hardware Pultec it's by Tega are you manufacturer? It's a German? Yeah, boutique audio, like manufacturer. It's a cloud, but it's not an exact clone and it's a really high end one. So it's a, it's a stereo Pultec que that I really love. And I always thought like, no, none of my politic plugins sound the same. So I have, I kept using it and I did the comparison now and I found that. When I try, when I measure the, the curves and like the actual Q curve that I can get. And I tried to get the same thing with like fab filter pro Q I can match the Q curve, like almost perfectly because faculty pro Q is so powerful that you can put an analyzer on, send a test signal through, see what the Pultec does, and just try to match it with the fab filter. And that works very well. The thing that's missing then is the difference between the two channels. If you use it on a stereo bus, for example, and the way the box sounds because the fat filter is very clean. So there is some [00:22:00] saturations and box tone to it that the fed filter does have, it's fascinating to see how close you can get by just matching the Q curve. Like when you. Um, without the saturation at the Buxton, but just matching the curves like that, there is a difference, but it's like not night and day. It's like pretty close to the analog thing just by matching what the cue does. And then I, I thought, okay, let's, let's put on some, like, let's try some saturation plugins that I have. Let's just dial in a little bit of saturation, the different characteristics that see what that does. And then I threw it on. Uh, console simulation plugin, that gives a little bit of a difference between left and right. And I try to mess with these things. And of course I couldn't get it to, to cancel completely or to be the exact same thing, but it doesn't have to be, but I could get pretty quickly actually something that's just as cool. It's not the same thing, but just as cool and this exact same job. So, and, and on the, and while I was doing that, I discovered a few more options that actually gave me additional flavors and things that I could use that was actually much more versatile than just my Pultec that had that one sound. So. 

[00:22:57] Malcom: Right 

[00:22:58] Benedikt: Now that took a [00:23:00] little bit of work, of course, but I just saved them as presets and like as templates and now I can use them all and I don't have a need for my politic anymore. And it's all that to say, you can't, you can't make that comparison at home. Of course, if you don't have that tool, but if you just have a clear vision, what you want your songs or your track to sound like, and if you do a little bit of research, why certain people use certain tools on certain sources, maybe. You can just start experimenting with whatever you have and kind of come up with cool Janes that serve a similar purpose and like do a similar thing. And it doesn't really matter if it's the exact same thing. It's just, you got to just find something that works and you can absolutely do that and you can get creative and you might discover things that actually are better than whatever hardware you were going to buy. So, That's that's the takeaway for me. And I really want to encourage you to just dry that. And two, you can be confident that there's something in your door. If you just combine it the right way, that's just as magical or [00:24:00] vibe-y or whatever, as like some hardware that you could buy. So it's just the clever use of it, like how you use it. And, and it takes some experience probably to get that sound in your head to really know what to listen for. But yeah, it can be done. It can definitely be done and it doesn't even have to be matched to a piece. Absolutely 

[00:24:17] Malcom: Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. I'm most excited about plugins these days that aren't clones, you know, that are coming up that are like, this is a new thing. It's like, oh, cool. I want to hear what this sounds like. That that's, what's exciting to me these days. to me these 

[00:24:31] Benedikt: Yeah, for sure. Like all the intelligent plugins, but also like just cool concepts, just new compressor behaviors that wouldn't be possible, like in the analog world or, um, crazy cue curves that are not possible in the analog GQ in the analog world. And, and as I said, like the saturation, there are so many tools in the, in the box that you can use to combine and, and create cool saturated sound. That's not a real argument for analog as well anymore. So I think it's just how you use it and what you want to create. [00:25:00] So, yeah, that's basically it, like when it comes to, um, what else can we can like comes to mind when you think about convenience? Because I have a couple more things, especially when it comes to like the more trivial things or when it comes to exporting or mastering, there are a couple of things that, that, that come to mind that you shouldn't cut corners. When you do that. So for example, I just give one example, if you, and I heard who was it? I heard a mastering guy on a Facebook live lately, recently who talked about that. And that really stuck with me when, when he was saying, okay, so he was basically agreeing that there are things that can be done easier and faster, and you're not losing anything, but there are things that you should do properly. For example, if you want. If you have a stereo track, a finished mix, and there is a problem on an individual source and it's really just that source instead of being lazy or convenient and like notching it out on the master or, um, I don't know any, any added to the [00:26:00] master that solves a specific problem on one track. Instead, you should go back to the multi-track session, fix it there. Printed again, and then go to the mastering, even if that requires like a lot of back and forth and stuff like that. But you would sacrifice something if you would just be lazy and fix it in the last step or like, things like that. You know? So there are things and like workflow things that people do all the time, just because they think, oh God, like won't, it won't matter when it actually will matter. And when it actually pays off to go the extra mile and like, if you ha if you can do it, and I think if you doing a lot of it yourself, You have the option to go back most of the time, it's just, are you willing to do it or not? And I think these things will make much more of a difference and are more important to think about than which plugin you use. It's just this, the right mindset. Like what, what matters. And I'm a willing to do it if I can do it and what doesn't really matter. And can it save me time and make me for it more efficient. So any thoughts on that? Yeah. 

[00:26:55] Malcom: I mean, I agree. I totally agree. I think at the end of the day, what we're telling [00:27:00] people to do is like, if you own gear. You should be questioning why you own it. And if there's something that's much more important that you don't have. So, and then if that's the case, you got to re reallocate those resources. Um, and, and it's the smartest thing you could do. Just get rid of the stuff you don't actually need and make sure that you have all of the essentials covered. That's really what we're saying. And if on the flip side, if you are. Sitting there thinking that you need the hardware that's, what's holding you back then. No, you just gotta get back to work and figure out the ways around it. You just gotta sit at your computer and create the chains That sound good chains. That sound 

[00:27:38] Benedikt: Yeah. And one final example that I want to give, where it actually can be beneficial to the, to the quality you get to the actual result. If you reduce your, your yeah. The, the tools you're using and if you get rid of the analog stuff, in my case, for example, is, so I have this big desk in front of me with two wrecks with the analog gear. And as you said, I don't like empty [00:28:00] Rackspace. So once the analog gear is gone, that I don't need anymore, I'll have this. Thing in front of me. So what I'm going to do, especially when, when move to my new control room, once we built our house that we're planning and all of that, then. I got rid of this big desk and I'm just going to have the smallest desk possible in front of me, like a really minimalist setup with the speakers ideally positioned and everything in the room, acoustics really dialed in which I have right now, but it just can't be better. And the less stuff I have in front of me and the smaller the desk is the better. My acoustics will be the better my monitoring will be. So because this, this huge desk is actually. Bad for what I'm hearing from my speakers. It just has to be that because it holds the gear, but it doesn't serve any other purpose. Like it's just, uh, actually it's it's in my way. So. Th that can be actually, and it will be beneficial actually to have the smallest possible desk like acoustically transparent, just the gear. I really need less wiring, less cabling, less noise, less everything and just monitoring as good as possible. And that was. That [00:29:00] will actually make me mix better. And maybe I can even afford a pair of better, like high-end converters or anything. I have good ones, but who knows, like I could invest that money into things that matter more or new speakers or whatever. So I could actually save money while improving my setup and get a better result. So that's another thing. So, and, and I've, I've looked at a lot of DIY spaces where people have these wrecks and huge tables in front of them that are basically full of things. They don't really need, and they just love to have them or see them. And if that inspires you again, that might be a valid thing here. So some people just love to be surrounded by things and they are more creative. And if that's you, then by all means, do, do what works. But yeah, but if not that person, maybe you could do a better job with less in between you and your. Absolutely 

[00:29:49] Malcom: Yep. Absolutely. I love that. A lot of people probably hadn't thought about that before, but desks are actually like just one of the most terrible things in your room for, for the sound of what's going on. Like they're [00:30:00] just a necessary evil that we have to live with because we need something to put our gear on. So if you get rid of that gear, you can make it much smaller. I I'm sure there's a lot of people that think like, oh, big, big desk, good studio. But it's like, well, that's just a big, huge problem.

[00:30:14] Benedikt: Yeah. Yeah, true. Very, very true. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. And then think about it. If you ever ex not in front of you, but like next to you, depending on how they're set up, you're constantly have to move out of the sweet spot. And like, there's always a downside to that versus just having everything right there, being in the sweet spot, nothing in the way between you and your speakers. That's so much better than having to do all these weird things to, in order to reach your gear. And no, no, it's yeah that word. absolutely 

[00:30:43] Malcom: absolutely. That's funny That's 

[00:30:45] Benedikt: All right. So yeah, I think, I think that's it. That's all I wanted to say today. I just wanted to share that with you because I was surprised myself and I was, and it was a really cool thing to discover that actually, none of the things I valued so much were actually [00:31:00] doing something I really needed. So there's not a single piece that I really need at the end of the day. Not a single one. So there you go 

[00:31:08] Malcom: There you go get rid of them, buddy. Okay. one thing I want to before we go. And uh, last couple episodes we asked for reviews and we talked about something called the bystander effect where you just assume that somebody else is going to do it. So you don't need to, I think it's called the bystander effect, right? bystander 

[00:31:22] Benedikt: right it is. 

[00:31:23] Malcom: Yup. 

[00:31:24] Benedikt: a very terrible example for that, but it is yet. to 

[00:31:26] Malcom: Yeah If you want to listen to me talking about terrible stuff, you can go back and listen to that. But what I wanted to say is that it happened. Nobody did it. Nobody did it. Come on. There's a lot of people that listen to this podcast and, uh, we'd really appreciate it. If you left us a review, preferably on apple podcasts, that'd be fantastic. Go and do it please. Thank you. Don't assume somebody else will assume somebody else 

[00:31:47] Benedikt: Thank you, man. Thank you for saying that again. Yes. Do it. And for the people who reached out about Spotify and not being able to leave a review there. Yep. That's true. At least not for now. I think they, they wanted to add a review feature, but I think that's not working right now, [00:32:00] but. Here's the thing. If you have an apple device, I don't even know if that's a requirement, but if you have an apple device, you can go to Apple's apple podcasts anyway, and just leave a review, even if you'll listen on Spotify. So if you want to help us out, do it, please. 

[00:32:13] Malcom: Thank 

[00:32:14] Benedikt: you. Thank you. Bye. See you next week.


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